Restaurant Responsibility
I inadvertently kicked off an interesting discussion on a town listserv. I was commenting that I had recently eaten in a new restaurant and the staff was super accommodating. When I asked them if something was vegetarian (and then followed it up with a specific question about how we may be defining “vegetarian” in different ways), the person taking my order volunteered that a few other items on the menu weren’t vegetarian but they had vegetarian options available if I needed them. For instance, the tortillas contained lard, but they had vegan tortillas––you only had to ask.
One person lamented that she had eaten at the restaurant, not knowing that the tortillas weren’t vegetarian, and wished that the restaurant would make that clear on the menu. Another person pointed out that it was the customer’s responsibility to ask.
Which sort of begged the question: how do you ask when you don’t realize that you need to ask unless you ask about everything?
This woman clearly didn’t know that tortillas sometimes contain lard and you need to ask if you’re a vegetarian. If you’re not a distrustful, asking-the-same-question-multiple-times person like me, you probably take for granted that something that seems vegetarian is vegetarian.
Even a distrustful, asking-the-same-question-multiple-times person like me makes assumptions in new places. For instance, if I’m ordering a salad and only vegetables are listed in the description with a vinaigrette, I don’t ask them if they’ve happen to go rogue and sprinkled cricket-protein over the whole dish. Like I said, some things are obvious and some things you can’t even begin to guess don’t fit your dietary needs when they usually do.
What do you think? Is it the restaurant’s responsibility to mark every item, or is it the customer’s responsibility to ask about everything they’re ordering? I have no clue how listing it works unless restaurant print the ingredients list for each item.
12 comments
Hmm. If they note any item as vegetarian, then yes, they should note the status of all items. I already knew good tortillas are made with lard, but that’s because I use lard for my pie crusts, AS PLEASETH THE LORD.
But otherwise, I do think it is on the eater to ask. Serious (ethical, as opposed to maybe for health reasons) vegetarians I have known have known things like marshmallows are not vegetarian.
That said, if I am having people over to eat, I make sure to learn what they don’t eat. And when I take food to work, I warn people that the pie crust has lard. It’s not my goal to trick anyone.
Well, I think you touched on this a bit in your post, that vegetarian can mean different things to different people. Even some definitions of vegan can vary depending on the person. When I think of someone not eating tortillas with lard, that says more vegan to me than vegetarian.
A lot of restaurants have an asterisk by certain items that can be made vegan/gluten free ect if you ask.
To me if I didn’t know the tortilla had lard and inadvertently ate it while being a vegetarian/vegan…well you don’t know what you don’t know, right? I mean, you can be mad about it, but that’s kind of the chance you take eating anywhere other than your own home. If it’s a health issue thing like celiac, that’s totally different than someone who is vegan for moral or other issue, like the food won’t actually hurt them. I dunno. With so many food fads and definitions of vegetarian/vegan/gf for celiac bs gf for diet, Keto, ect I don’t know how testosterone to be expected to keep up with it all on their menu to please everyone and fit everyone’s definition. So I think it’s more up to the consumer if they have specific dietary needs to be aware of what they are eating, or not get so upset if they do eat a tortilla with lard. No, if a restaurant is touting a vegan or gluten free menu or choices, then they should disclose ingredients to the best of their ability.
Well, I think you touched on this a bit in your post, that vegetarian can mean different things to different people. Even some definitions of vegan can vary depending on the person. When I think of someone not eating tortillas with lard, that says more vegan to me than vegetarian.
A lot of restaurants have an asterisk by certain items that can be made vegan/gluten free ect if you ask.
To me if I didn’t know the tortilla had lard and inadvertently ate it while being a vegetarian/vegan…well you don’t know what you don’t know, right? I mean, you can be mad about it, but that’s kind of the chance you take eating anywhere other than your own home. If it’s a health issue thing like celiac, that’s totally different than someone who is vegan for moral or other issue, like the food won’t actually hurt them. I dunno. With so many food fads and definitions of vegetarian/vegan/gf for celiac bs gf for diet, Keto, ect I don’t know how testosterone to be expected to keep up with it all on their menu to please everyone and fit everyone’s definition. So I think it’s more up to the consumer if they have specific dietary needs to be aware of what they are eating, or not get so upset if they do eat a tortilla with lard. No, if a restaurant is touting a vegan or gluten free menu or choices, then they should disclose ingredients to the best of their ability.
It feels like this is another thing in an growing trend in this world where we expect everything everywhere to be someone else’s responsibility to tell us or provide for us or what have you. I think the bottom line is is that if you do not eat anything at all made with any part of an animal then you need to ask to make sure. And then you are still taking a chance that someone recognizes that lard is an animal bi-product and in the tortillas.🤷♀️
I think in the case where a reasonable person might assume that an item is vegetarian from the description (such as tortillas), it would be a good idea for the restaurant to mention that they’re not vegetarian in the description. I feel similarly about french fries fried in lard, for example. I think most french fries people encounter wouldn’t be fried in lard, so a reasonable person might assume they’re vegetarian. Of course, defining what’s “reasonable” is the trick, but I think the restaurant should err on the side of over-describing rather than under-describing. (Not vegetarian, but have a vegetarian mother who’s favorite food is french fries. I don’t think she asks.)
I come down on the side of making sure people are aware of sneaky/unexpected allergens in foods – we have a very popular local breakfast place that uses peanut oil for some frying and has a sign in the window + on the menus since hash browns/eggs/etc are not things most people would reasonably guess to be a peanut allergen. Trickier for things like tortillas that one might assume are vegetarian but also are known to be made with lard if one knows the cuisine…I guess I’d sort of put that on the person to ask? Though certainly it wouldn’t be bad for the restaurant to note it somewhere. Sort of a grey area where I can see both sides, that one. In the end, though, I think it comes down to the person to check.
One of the first things I always ask when we invite people over is if they have any dislikes/restrictions/allergies when it comes to food. It’s not a good time or being hospitable if someone winds up at the hospital or eats something that violates their moral/religious tenets. Taking food to potlucks now, I often will put a note to list sneaky stuff that might hide (for example, I sometimes make beef tips that have flour – thus gluten) on the container.
I have an allergy to dairy (not lactose intolerance) and I find that restaurants often don’t include when cheese is sprinkled over pasta or a salad. I always ask – and sometimes get annoyed responses because why would there be cheese when it’s not listed in the description? – because I feel like otherwise it falls to the server to fix my issue, and it really wasn’t their fault.
But I’m also a question everything person.
Who doesn’t know that most tortillas contain lard? I think it’s incumbent upon the customer to ask for ingredients if they have dietary restrictions or requirements.
Actually I woul think most tortillas don’t contain lard these days…that one in particular should have been called out especially if they note vegetarian items. I’ve been vegan 14 years, vegetarian 7 before that and I know to ask about a lot of things but tortillas are not something I would think to ask about (perhaps in a hole in the wall place but then I normally wouldn’t go somewhere like that). Plus why is that restaurant serving tortillas with lard at all considering they have regular ones available? Yuck.
Cheese on the salad that’s not mentioned on the menu is a big pet peeve of mine. I’ve sent many a salad back for that reason. Also when a dish described as containing vegetables shows up including unmentioned mushrooms. They are fungus! Not vegetables! (bc I hate them, not bc of a dietary issue. Although I do know someone who is allergic.)
Generally I think it’s on the restaurant. C’mon it’s 2019.
And the reality is it’s good for business. I’m more likely to patronize a place that takes the effort to not what’s vegan etc.
When I was allergic to wheat during pregnancy I eventually ended up only eating at places that specifically marked gluten free on their menus. The other places that weren’t chains that specifically catered to gluten free would often lie (or charitably not know) and I would end up throwing up an hour later.
So… I think some restaurants have this capability and the others might be worth not patronizing if they don’t label your specific thing.
We have had more luck asking about red dye which my daughter is allergic to. Maybe that’s easier than knowing Worcester sauce often has wheat. She’s had a few reactions but not many (and will probably never eat another hotdog in her life, since she’s been lied to about that twice).
So…I am sort of on the side of it being on the consumer to ask if they have any specific dietary restrictions, whether allergy or just lifestyle. While I agree restaurants should include all ingredients in a dish or note if something is vegan/gluten free, there is no way they could account for all of the possible definitions of and all of the different dietary needs. There is also a huge difference between someone who is gluten-free for perceived benefits vs someone who has celiac. I think whenever you eat food that is not your own, you are taking a chance that you might consume something that doesn’t align with your beliefs or dietary needs.
For example…I had no idea that fresh made tortillas from a restaurant contained lard…because any I have looked at in the store do not. It doesn’t matter to me because I’m not vegan. I’m not Mexican and I have never made them, so I wouldn’t know. Also…wouldn’t know that red dye is in hot dogs. I don’t eat hot dogs, but it’s not something I would have guessed is in them.
I guess my point is that there are so many things anymore that people have allergies to and so many ways of eating and different definitions of those things, there is no way a restaurant could keep up and please everyone and note everything. So unless they are going to start posting every ingredient list on every item they use (which is impractical and ridiculous) then it really is up to someone to be informed enough to ask questions.
If it were my restaurant, I’d put a note on the menu that advises diners to please ask questions about ingredients if they aren’t sure. Or, denote veg-safe items with an asterisk or something. That said, I, too, believe it’s on the diner to educate themselves about the customs and conventions of whatever diet they wish to follow, so that they can ask informed questions when eating out. When I went low-carb and tried out gluten-free, I had to do some research to be sure I was not eating things that inadvertently sabotaged my best intentions. It’s what one does.
Similar to Beth, I’m also lactose intolerant but I often assume something like a salad or sandwich is dairy free when it doesn’t list anything dairy sounding in the ingredients. However I’ve often been disappointed to find the salad covered in a yoghurt dressing or cheese in the sandwhich for instance so I find it’s better to be on the safe side and ask!